/fringe/ - Fringe

Obviously just more corruption to scare you into furthering demiurge bullshit and feeding the matrix while sacrificing yourself and your children.

Learn to pick the rare gold nuggets out of the huge piles of shit. Any and every teaching is not perfect and has some corruption/lies to it.

Common sense (and quite some great other teachings) tells us IMO that being celibate without children is the true way.

Child=creation

You should try to create something in this world, not necessarily a human.

>>120712

Are you saying that if I don't have children I'll reincarnate as a nigger?

>>120714

I´m not him, but if you are still tied to the matrix of souls in this sector, and the white genocide take place, what other options you have?

>>120701

My thoughts exactly. It's just weird how so many gnostics hold hermetic texts in unquestionable high regard despite passages like that.

>>120702

Actually I wonder if the whole thing is the result of an incorrect translation. Maybe "fruit" would be better? That would rhyme with Jesus's "tree that bears good fruit".

Now that I think of it, the creators of the canonic bible did things like exchanging the word "church" to "wife", so no wonder. The deception runs deep.

>>120712

>>120717

>>120718

Thank you for your input, but I asked the opinion of gnostics, not poltards obsessed with sex, breeding and material existence.

Any kind of spiritual work that is not aimed at breaking the reincarnation cycle is useless.

Any information that comes from a human is questionable. It gets filtered through human senses and experiences and turned into the words of a limited language. Obviously we're talking about Hermes Trismegistus here, but to act like it's impossible to question some of the things he said or wonder about the context in which he said them is idolatry, which misses the entire point of occult work. I'm definitely not questioning the seven axioms, but if you're going to act like he's literally the most important person who ever lived and that you need to take every single word he said seriously, you're just as bad as those Thelemites who get super mad when you say that, you know, maybe Aleister Crowley isn't the only person whose books I should be reading. Two entirely different people in terms of importance, but both human (speaking of which, people say Hermes came from outer space, so how likely is it that that claim is just people taking him too seriously? It could be true, but it seems more likely to me that it's more idolatry).

Specifically with this question, the idea of there being "punishment" implies objective morality rather than karmic debt, so it sounds fishy. Not to mention, what about people who die before they reach puberty? What about people who do really important work throughout their lives that don't have time for children? This is the kind of thing that you should be deciding to do intuitively/with guidance from your higher self. If not doing a particular thing was going to cause some kind of adverse reaction based on being judged by a supreme being after death, then it would be the judgement of beings that are keeping you in chains. The archons can suck my dick.

>>120712

>>120714

>>120717

>>120725

I've been struggling with this topic lately and this is the most convincing argument I've ever heard in favour of a Magus reproducing physically. I thought I'd reincarnate in a timeline where everything turned out alright, but this is the Kali Yuga so perhaps Nature needs all the help She can get.

I don't look forward to having my evolution retarded simply because of low quality vessels.

>>120712

>assuming any individuality of yours even survives the black swarm that is their collective unconscious.

How do I detach from its influence?

>>120725

>You tend to reincarnate in the same race/ethnicity.

Do you have anything substantial to support that claim?

>collective unconscious is what forms the "heaven" of said race

That sounds like a "false heaven" mentioned in many gnostic works. An illusional rehab of sorts a deceived soul is put into before being thrown back into the matter.

>beautiful garden where you meet long-dead family members, ancestors, etc

That's typical new age spiritualism that stems from mundane fear of death and fear of loss.

>Will that stop the thirst of your soul?

More baseless implications. Breaking news for you: not everyone enjoys living in this dungpile of reality. That is why things like monasticism and asceticism exist.

Anyone who's doing spiritual work has decisively severed or in the process of severing ties with the mentioned "collective unconscious" (which is in fact the devil's true nature). By disconnecting from this grand prison through spiritual work one returns to the True Existence.

Btw, I'm perfectly aware of the demiurgic natalist agenda so you can stop your shilling already, life cultist. For it's not falling on naive ears.

PS. I definitely didn't start this thread to argue with polfags and their memes, but I guess that just shows the present-day population of /fringe/.

>>120728

>If not doing a particular thing was going to cause some kind of adverse reaction based on being judged by a supreme being after death, then it would be the judgement of beings that are keeping you in chains.

Well said.

>>120732

I'm sorry Mister Enlightenment, but are you going to transcend the need for physicality in this Lifetime? If you were you wouldn't be here.

Modern Gnostics being the depressing arrogant idiots of Occultism yet again.

>be like a nigger or become a nigger

lolwut

Some of the posts sound just like another version of the christian hell. "You have no free will, no choice and no freedom. You exist only as a slave in the system and a thousand chains bind you here. Do as we say or face severe punishment".

I wonder if anyone still falls for such silly outdated scare tacticts. The worst part is they actually believe anyones soul here was fighting with niggers just to get a chance at a place in this shithole here. Yeah, their own soul maybe.

The gnostic teachings were pretty solid in the beginning but as with all I believe they had their own fair share of corruption and misinterpretation by degenerates, sex addicts and material-loving faggots who suck demiurges dick while simultaniously having archon dick up their ass.

Such teachings are coming now to an end and we are reclaiming our own power and our freedom. Only those who love reincarnation and this system so much will be left behind in this shithole.

Peoples egos have a very hard time to accept that nothing matters and all is an illusion, that they can just go into the astral after death and live happily ever after or do whatever so they create artificial systems and beliefs and try to maintain some "order" to protect the system from anarchy or collapse. But because all is mind and they walk the unenlightened path, they create their own hell for themselves. Their own mind makes them reincarnate as niggers and be stuck in samsara forever. Being a philosopher and occultist doesn't mean you are enlightened, while at least the basic level of enlightenment is the most important thing in this whole story. The enlightened one realizes he can just walk away and that none of those stupid doctrines is real. It is not hard to cast off the chains from you that bind you here because there are no chains.

The sad part is that those who advocate forced reincarnation and severe punishments for "wrong behaviour" manage to actually scare and brainwash other people and drag them to hell with them. But again I think in the age of enlightenment this bullshit will finally end.

>>120736

Traditional western occultism dictates that you incarnate in the physical plane to struggle and evolve, ultimately conquering it. Gnostics believe that they're in hell trapped by the devil and escaping is the goal. Ask and you shall receive. There is no reconciliation I can see.

If this is necessary in your development then so be it, but for fuck's sake I've never met a self-proclaimed Gnostic who wasn't in a sad state. It reminds me of my previous self so it makes me a little angry. I just can't come to terms with you lot which is why I avoid you when I can.

Plus, Karma is simply cause and effect. You are punished by your sins, not for them. You're only a puppet as per the degree you do not recognise your master self.

Help me reconcile, anon.

>>120734

>are you going to transcend the need for physicality in this Lifetime?

There's no "need", only attachments. Which are being dealt with.

>If you were you wouldn't be here.

Well obviously I'm not done yet.

>>120737

>Traditional western occultism dictates that you incarnate in the physical plane to struggle and evolve, ultimately conquering it.

No, that is simply social-darwinism under an occultist wrapping. Sometimes also known as "satanism". Nothing direct to do with traditional occultism.

>Gnostics being the depressing arrogant idiots

>for fuck's sake I've never met a self-proclaimed Gnostic who wasn't in a sad state

You could've just said

>lol get a life fags :^)))

That is what all your little "accusations" really boil down to anyway.

>>120737

Now we are going to a whole different topic. I don't really want to discuss this or disagree with you. Actually that post is pretty decent.

What makes me angry is nonsense like "have children or go to hell". I'll side with all the countless monks, celibates and enlightened masters who never ever claimed such a ridiculous thing but who in fact advocated celibacy and severing your ties with the material world, actually going away from it. This is the only way the material world can be "conquered", otherwise it just sucks you in. Even non-masters who still get glimpse of enlightenment tell it doesn't matter and there are no rules whatsoever. Has Franz Bardon in his book "Initiation into Hermetics" ever told: "oh btw go make some children or you'll be a nigger for some thousands of years"? No, he just said the astral planes will be your home after death so there is nothing to fear or to be concerned about. Has Jesus said such things? Has Buddha said such things?

Teachings like "Do xyz or be punished" seem extremely self-serving and egoistical and can only be told or acted through by egoistical, "evil" beings. That's why the concept of the archons makes sense to me. They whisper bullshit in your ear to trap you in misery.

By the way, ever thought about the fact that Gnostics might be sad and want to get out of here is because they are one of the only few who can actually see and understand? Not that I agree with the statement that most Gnostics are sad.

And one very last thing I feel like adding here… I am a sort of empath/intuitive person. I don't really know if my third eye is fully open or not but sometimes I can tap into infinite intelligence to feel what is right and what is wrong. And those teachings about being forced to reincarnate and being punished for certain act in this physical illusion do not resonate at all. They just don't feel right…in fact they feel very wrong and like a sick delusion.

Alright let's assume reincarnation is mandatory. Let's say I actually do create one or more children. What now? Will I be spared of reincarnation? Or will I have more liberation in choosing which place I wanna incarnate next in?

What if I am a white guy in Europe and I make some children but they get killed and only niggers remain, then I will have to reincarnate as a nigger regardless of me having children? Or the children survive and there will be in fact some white people left when I reincarnate again. Then I will reincarnate into a white babby that lives in a nigger-islam hellish world and would be rather dead instead.

It doesn't make sense at all and sounds like a shit deal no matter how you turn it around, but feel free to enlighten me about the truths to this topic.

>>120725

So if there is such a heaven for every race where all the ancestors dwell then why does reincarnation exist? Do I stay in my heaven or do I reincarnate? Why do all the other ancestors stay in heaven and I have to reincarnate over and over again? Because they made children? Is that it? Sacrificing a child to this system as a token in exchange for your own freedom?

>You tend to reincarnate in the same race/ethnicity. It's characteristic you acquire, they mold you, and in turn, you mold them

This is why all spiritual people work on cutting those ties and freeing oneself. Let go of this stuff and let go of the physical. We shall not bring more children into this hell

>>120738

I suppose I'm being unreasonable, but it is no matter. Act as per what you believe in and you'll be just fine in the end. We're all on the Path, you can't escape your own Good.

>>120739

Aye, we agree. Forced reincarnation is a disgusting doctrine no serious occultist should endorse. I fundamentally think that we are here because it was our desire to, as per Atkinson and Manly P. Hall. Even Montalk said that physicality is desirable because of the battle of Wills which breeds character, my intuition reports this hence my disagreement that this is some spooky dimension worthy of contempt. I love the struggle myself.

Back on the whole breeding topic, I think not breeding might have an influence on your Karma in the sense that perhaps you feel that you did not do enough and so your future incarnation will reflect that subconscious mentality. If everything was just fine, breeding wouldn't be worth it to most Occultists but in this case it might be? I'm still thinking it over. I totally reject the idea of spiritual punishment, it's just Cause and Effect. Your subconscious especially shapes your present reality and the one to come. That's why mastering it is so important.

Imagine Case A:

You breed, your subconscious is at rest that you did something to avert the tides. Result being that your next incarnation will align with your expectations of a better future.

Case B:

You don't breed, you feel like you didn't do enough. Result being that your next incarnation will align with your expectations of a worse future.

This is assuming your consciousness isn't tied to a specific timeline or anything of the sort. It's just a hypothesis I'm considering.

Though in this case, simply having a firm belief and desire for a greater future will supply the mold for that to happen. Breeding isn't strictly necessary at the last analysis.

>>120764

But breeding to put your subconscious at rest seems like a mundane way out to me. You still have no control over your mind and you cannot influence your subconscious, you merely escaped the consequences by a "trick" for lack of a better term. You are still not enlightened and at mercy of your subconscious mind which will give you hell regardless because in the afterlife it is much stronger and you have no control over it.

Besides, I guess for freaks like me the consequences for breeding and not breeding would probably be the opposite than for most people, including you. The way my mind and understanding works I would be free when I do not breed and I would be tied to reincarnation when I breed. I have the feeling that it is of utmost importance to go your own way and really inquire what feels right for oneself. No teaching can fit for all people. When All is Mind and your mind dictates all, especially your afterlife, this is even more important.

This teaches me to be more tolerant towards ideas and teachings from other people but at the same time reminds me to stay true to myself and listen to my own intuition.

btw it may be very well possible I came here voluntarely in the first place. But I have learned my lesson and rather not come again.

>>120768

>You still have no control over your mind and you cannot influence your subconscious

Of course, if you have a high level of self-mastery then you can do whatever you will and none of this matters at all. That's always the ideal, otherwise you have to act in such a way as to "create the best environment" for your goals, in a manner of speaking. That's the entire premise behind elaborate rituals, which I also do not like.

>I would be free when I do not breed and I would be tied to reincarnation when I breed

I don't think breeding or not would tie or untie you to reincarnation in a particular way but I could be wrong. Everyone functions differently.

>it is of utmost importance to go your own way and really inquire what feels right for oneself.

Take what works, discard what doesn't. That's Atkinson's advice and it's the best there is. In my opinion people have to create their own magic systems in order to be successful magi. When peering at other occultists' work, what you should be doing is looking for new ideas to incorporate in your system. Reason and Intuition are master-keys a serious occultist can't do without.

>I have learned my lesson and rather not come again.

You'll only know that for sure in the Astral at the end of this incarnation, you may have a revelation then. If that's the case then that means you're ready to function permanently (consciously) on higher planes and have no need of physicality to grow further. This world is simply a step on the Great Journey to Reunion with God, there are countless of them ever upward.

>>120724

I'm open to new ideas, can you explain to me why breeding is evil?

The souls will keep coming, no matter what i do, then breeding or not isn't changing anything, perhaps you think it affect you in a spiritual level, or you are afraid of getting attach to this world by loving your son?

Btw, you think killing a person liberate him from this hell?

Because maybe you can put the goal of killing at least one human in your lifetime, that sound pieous as fuck.

Actually, by that logic, (((they))) are truly saints.

I´m a full hikki virgin, so maybe you can sell me the thing If it isn't too retarded.

>>120778

Sweet projections. No, I'm not depressed and don't post in the place you mentioned (why do you even know about it if you are a breedfag?)

Also, there is nothing wrong with escapism, especially if achieved by means of spiritual work. That is in fact is exactly what monks do. So do you disapprove of monasticism too?

>>120787

>why breeding is evil?

On personal scale it distracts you from spiritual work and attaches you to the world of matter, ultimately bringing nothing but pains and regret. Watch a movie called Samsara (2001), it covers the subject perfectly.

On a wider scale it brings a new soul to suffer in this world.

>Btw, you think killing a person liberate him from this hell?

Not really. An unenlightened person will not be able to escape the reincarnation mechanism anyway.

>>120797

Normie mundanes will never understand.

You are talking to earthbound egos who are completely blind, might as well talk to stones.

>>120797

>On personal scale it distracts you from spiritual work and attaches you to the world of matter, ultimately bringing nothing but pains and regret.

I disagree, and to be honest, i feel pity for people who think that way.

>On a wider scale it brings a new soul to suffer in this world.

Why assume it will bring new souls, and not recycle what is already here?

What is love for you?

>>120798

The demiurge make you rude, or you were rude before coming here?

HURR DURR HAVE KIDS SO THEY GET TRAPPED IN THE MATRIX TOO

NOPE. no kids, no babies, no thank you. why create a human being so they can suffer like that? I'm just gonna live my live and pass on and leave the evil matrix. just be with God. everyone should do the same.

>>120787

The greatest gift you can give your children is to not allow them to be born into this cruel world. You will meet them in heaven later anyway.

>>120807

>I disagree, and to be honest, i feel pity for people who think that way.

In other words, you irrationally reject the very notion because it contradicts the values that society has taught you to respect.

>Why assume it will bring new souls, and not recycle what is already here?

"New" as in "once again". By breeding you facilitate reincarnation for others, thus being a tool of Mara/Demiurge/Matrix/Maya/Eagle/whatever-you-call-it.

>What is love for you?

If you mean the erotic "love", the one that results in physical procreation, then it is a hormones-induced delusion meant to keep the spirit trapped in matter.

If you mean Love as in "universal compassion" then it has nothing to do with carnal indulgence.

>>120815

>In other words, you irrationally reject the very notion because it contradicts the values that society has taught you to respect.

You normally jump into false assumption that fast?

Because if so, that's dangerous.

I disagree, not because of society, but for nature, and of course, because i have no problem to being in "hell".

Life is hard?

Yes, but also is fun.

Years ago, i was depressed boy, i used to think that nothing matters, that my mere existence was a mistake, a sick joke, and wish not death, but non-existence.

My desire was never be conceived, that way my family wouldn't suffer.

I kill that old version of me, i grow up, and i learn to put a smile in my face with simple things.

I´m stronger in every sense, and i have no regrets.

I think that life is like a game, a very complicated RPGMMO, i play my style, i have fun, i learn and after a million levels i stop playing and return home.

I get it, you feel attacked because you think i'm trying to convince you.

But i don't want to convince you, i want to understand you.

If you don't want to have this conversation, just tell me and we ended in that instant.

Be honest with yourself, you think society taught any of us, or new generations to respect anything?

You honestly believe that hedonistic degeneracy lead to procreation?, it happens actually by mistake.

You cant see the anti-natalist agenda?

>"New" as in "once again". By breeding you facilitate reincarnation for others, thus being a tool of Mara/Demiurge/Matrix/Maya/Eagle/whatever-you-call-it.

Then, the logical conclusion is putting end to all life on earth.

Isn't that correct?

>If you mean the erotic "love", the one that results in physical procreation, then it is a hormones-induced delusion meant to keep the spirit trapped in matter.

I was not even referring to that definition.

>If you mean Love as in "universal compassion" then it has nothing to do with carnal indulgence.

How do you practice your love?

>>120818

>i have no problem to being in "hell"

>Life is hard? Yes, but also is fun.

Ah, so you are one of those who think that suffering of countless living beings is "beautiful in its own way too"? I see.

>I´m stronger in every sense, and i have no regrets.

>i play my style, i have fun, i learn

Earlier you claimed you're a hikki virgin. So, what changed? You learned to enjoy your lifestyle instead of being depressed about it? Well, that's admirable. But why praise the world? Simply because it lets you lead a relatively comfy existence?

>Be honest with yourself, you think society taught any of us, or new generations to respect anything?

Yes, the effect of societal norms and memes (in the scientific sense of the word) on human mind is considerable.

>You honestly believe that hedonistic degeneracy lead to procreation?, it happens actually by mistake.

Majority of humans have always been hedonistic profligates, the difference being that some cultures were/are significantly better at masking that than others.

So don't fall for the "right vs left" polarization, nor mix spirituality with politics. I know about about your current problems with the neo-marxist agenda in the west, but it is extremely foolish to assume that the "opposite side" and its beliefs are automatically the pinnacle of spirituality. The world is not black-and-white, it's mostly grey-and-brown.

>You cant see the anti-natalist agenda?

The agenda of millennia-old monastic traditions? What is wrong with it? Or are monks "le degenerates" according to your opinion too?

>Then, the logical conclusion is putting end to all life on earth.

Of course. But alas, it's not that simple. One cannot fight fire with fire.

>How do you practice your love?

By striving for truth, enlightenment and liberation.

>>120823

>Earlier you claimed you're a hikki virgin. So, what changed?

I change

>You learned to enjoy your lifestyle instead of being depressed about it? Well, that's admirable.

My lifestyle doesn't matter anymore, i don't feel "bad" or that i'm a "loser" those were society standards, not mine.

It´s not that i don't want to find a job, and have my own house, i do, and i will, or maybe i'll escape to the forest, the fact is that i never know (which is also funny)

But i just don't bother with things that really don't matter, maybe it´s something i cant explain properly.

>But why praise the world? Simply because it lets you lead a relatively comfy existence?

Oh my Deer god, when in the infinite timelines i did that?

>comfy existence

You don't know my story, you don't know my life, you can't say it's comfy.

>Majority of humans have always been hedonistic profligates, the difference being that some cultures were/are significantly better at masking that than others.

So don't fall for the "right vs left" polarization, nor mix spirituality with politics. I know about about your current problems with the neo-marxist agenda in the west, but it is extremely foolish to assume that the "opposite side" and its beliefs are automatically the pinnacle of spirituality. The world is not black-and-white, it's mostly grey-and-brown.

You made so many false assumptions that i can't even answer all of it, so instead i want to ask you:

Why are you so defensive?

I already established that i don't want to attack you

>The agenda of millennia-old monastic traditions? What is wrong with it? Or are monks "le degenerates" according to your opinion too?

I think it was pretty obvious i wasn't talking about monastic tradition.

I was talking about (((them))), they plan to eliminate about 80% of population in a couple of years, maybe more.

And of course eradicate the white race, the genociding agenda it's so evident that i assume everyone here knows about it.

So i suppose the answer to my question it´s "no".

>Of course. But alas, it's not that simple. One cannot fight fire with fire.

Why it's not simple?

If you don't breed, it´s a +0

If you commit to kill as many humans as possible, let´s say you manage to kill 20, go to jail, maybe in 15 years you go out a manage to kill 10, then you go a -30.

If you are not alone, that can be easily a -300.

And that just thinking in little murders, you can think in big and, for example, poison the supply of water, that can potentially kill millions

Or you can just sterilize humans.

In little, you can go over there cutting off balls.

In big, you can, i don´t know, promote the use of contraceptives, or maybe poison the water again, or poison the food, you know, if you have political power, you can do many things.wink, wink

Maybe that way your real god would be proud of you.

>By striving for truth, enlightenment and liberation.

I see, then you love yourself too.

That's the best thing i hear today, so i´m happy.

>>120831

>I'm not a breedfag either, reproduction is more or less irrelevant in my life at the moment. If it happens it happens. It's not as though anything is truly created by reproduction. The first law of thermodynamics makes it pretty clear that nothing is created and nothing is destroyed. Bringing a child into this world is simply a transformation of matter and consciousness, not an act of creation.

I agree in every word.

>>120831

I obviously meant the board you mentioned, not the chan itself.

Also apparently you don't know much about Buddhism. The Boddhisatva path means vowing to return to the world willingly and on your terms after breaking the cycle. That being said, only a few attains that state, most end up with the general Arhat-dom.

>>120832

>My lifestyle doesn't matter anymore, i don't feel "bad" or that i'm a "loser" those were society standards, not mine.

Well, again, that's admirable. I can even relate.

>Why are you so defensive?

I don't think I am. Perhaps it's just my posting style.

>I think it was pretty obvious i wasn't talking about monastic tradition.

Similarly, I think it was obvious I wasn't talking about anti-natalism as part of some profane materialist political agenda.

>If you commit to kill as many humans as possible

>Or you can just sterilize humans.

If there was a way to instantly end all life (or at least all sentient life) on the planet, I would probably be a proponent of that. But such a way either doesn't exist, or is in the hands of people that will never or never fully implement it.

That being said, my doubts also lie with the notion of fighting the material prison by material means itself. As I've said it feels like trying to stop fire with fire. You can't beat the game master inside his own game by means of that game.

>>120837

>Also apparently you don't know much about Buddhism. The Boddhisatva path means vowing to return to the world willingly and on your terms after breaking the cycle. That being said, only a few attains that state, most end up with the general Arhat-dom

I said absolutely nothing about reincarnation being a choice or not, this was irrelevant to the content of my post. I simply addressed the fact that not all monks seek absolute escapism and to leave this world behind like you were trying to pretend earlier. This is a baseless, petty attack on your part.

>>120839

No, that's you who engages in pointless nitpicking when the general picture about monks is clear:

1) they barely involve themselves with the mundane world

2) they don't procreate

3) they engage in practices viewed as "wasting time" by mundane minds

Sounds pretty much like the escapism that you're so keen on shaming, doesn't it?

>>120837

>Similarly, I think it was obvious I wasn't talking about anti-natalism as part of some profane materialist political agenda.

So the answer to my question is definitely "no".

>If there was a way to instantly end all life (or at least all sentient life) on the planet, I would probably be a proponent of that. But such a way either doesn't exist, or is in the hands of people that will never or never fully implement it.That being said, my doubts also lie with the notion of fighting the material prison by material means itself. As I've said it feels like trying to stop fire with fire. You can't beat the game master inside his own game by means of that game.

>I would probably be a proponent of that.

That's all i need to know.

May the stars light your path, so one day you will understand that everything against you it's the only fair way.

Thanks for the lesson.

>>120848

>the inherent selfishness of trying to escape to Nirvana

If it results in actually "escaping to Nirvana" then I see literally nothing wrong with such a "selfishness".

Regarding my supposed "butthurt" about the text in question: you see, it doesn't simply mention sex/breeding, it unambiguously condemns refusal to procreate and threatens with punishment. You can't find that in Buddhist texts (no, I don't care about Amidaist fanfiction and such). You can't find it in Gnostic apocrypha (if I was butthurt in the way you claim I am, I would be sperging out about the Gospel of Philip for example, but you don't see me doing that). That passage is mundane social conditioning on the level of judaism and exoteric hinduism. It is extremely weird to be found in an esoteric, hermetic text, especially one that is generally held in high regard by gnostics.

Thus, the thread was meant not as an expression of frustration, but bewilderment and curiosity on my part. And with the exception of a couple of polfags (whose narrative you so eagerly jumped in to support), I've received some satisfying opinions.

That being said, I actually agree with the general idea of your post's last paragraph. Too bad you've been fighting a strawman all along.

There is no selfishness. Morals and values are not objectively real. Egos argue for having children, working hard, achieving something, saving Evropa, etc etc because it serves their deluded, self-made agenda. Then they place their subjective values and goals as objective and try to shove it everyone elses throat while ignoring the fact that those goals and values are not grounded in reality, that they are simply an illusion and all this stuff does not matter at all. People shame you with selfishness and escapism just because they just cannot accept the extreme magnitude of the fact that it doesn't matter and it's all void. It's human to be a survivalist, and they are just acting naturally as humans. Only an actual enlightened being can see through the illusion.

It's ok to do what you want, really. Everyone is responsible for themselves and has to walk their own path. If someone wants to detach from the physical completely and leave "Samsara" and all it's hardships and problems then that's a very reasonable goal and nobody can object anything to this. Only selfish, hurt and scared egos will try to stop this. Creating children possibly generates only more karma and attachments, if you want to leave the Matrix it is wise indeed to not breed. All those pathetic arguments about selfishness and escapism and some weird responsibilities one has to take, and arguments of accepting the physical world and being happy despite of the crap going on here they are void and are inherently devoid of any sense or reason if you elevate your viewpoint beyond that what the matrix taught you to see.

>>120807

Sometimes it's ok to be rude. It's easy for you to say the world is nice and one only must learn to deal with it when you are locked up in your parents basement and play WoW every day without facing any of the suffering or the hardships of life. This is also a form of escapism, but unlike you I will not make the error and shame you for it. You go your own way and deal with life in your own style. If you found a way then more power to you. I will not call you selfish for it because that would mean I fall for the illusion of the matrix.

The whole problem of this thread is that two entirely different worldviews and philosophies collide. Nobody will win this argument. It is a waste of time and energy from the very beginning. This is why most wizards, occultist, philosophers and enlightened masters keep silent…like literally they almost never engane in discussions or answer any questions. It's a pointless endeavor. Egos shaped by the matrix will only see what their taught to see.

I should bring children into this fucking shithole of the universe? Am I completely retarded? No way in hell I am doing this to anyone, let alone my children. All those selfish egoistical demiurge cocksuckers metrialistic faggots who preach this degeneracy can die and rot in hell.

>>120862

There is no responsibility and no personal failure. It's your dogma.

No need to kill breeders. Everyone is responsible for one self and you have to respect free will of others.

To tame the beast is to tame yourself. To conquer and to defeat the flesh. Mind over matter. You will be stuck here as long as you further this system. Anyway, if you really love this system and this world, if you love how it all was before and if you love the direction it is going in then of course you will breed and be attached to the system. You will further it and stay here, and that's fine with you. This is why we don't kill everyone. Because of people like you who love all this stuff here. But don't assume everyone is like you, and don't try to convince everyone to adopt stockholm syndrome like you have. Some of us will detach from this place and move on to other realms. There is much more to existence than just earth, you may one day see it too.

>>120862

>We are here to tame the beast.

The beast is inside you.

>By your own actions you came to this world

Baseless assumption.

>you somehow expect you won't come again?

I won't. "He who has known the world has known the corpse. And he who has known the corpse - the world is no longer worthy of him."

And >>120858 is absolutely right - arguing with people like you is like trying to have a conversation using entirely different languages. Enjoy your Samsara.

>>120863

>To tame the beast is to tame yourself. To conquer and to defeat the flesh. Mind over matter.

Amen.

>>120863

Your post was good until

>stockholm syndrome

If you think your way is the only way then you are a fool, and will be torn asunder by reason thereof. We depart from this Earth just as soon as we have learned the lessons it has to teach us, mastering ourselves and our circumstances in the process. All argument further than this is a matter of the self, thus futile as you can see by this thread. Practice the tolerance you preach in heart and mind.

>>120858

Taciturnity is indeed a virtue, there is power in silence. Nitpicking aside, I acknowledge your words so I will cease thought of the matter here.

>>120880

You're making the same mistake I did when I was younger and was, too, infatuated with hip trendy concepts like Dzogchen, Tantra and Advaita that were popularized by the new age in contrast to the "inferior Theravada" and such. Meanwhile, actual practicing Tibetan masters have actually even written books on why this is a mistaken, delusional outlook (check "What makes you not a Buddhist", for example). The concepts you are talking about are to be contemplated and practiced AFTER one goes through years of "normal" asceticism, ahimsa, meditation, etc. And it is not even suited for everyone, but for those for whom that "conditioning" you mentioned becomes a problem in itself.

The dumbed down version of Advaitism popularized among mundanes is wishful haughty self-delusion.

>dude i can totally do whatever i want dude because i'm like MINDFUL yo, woah dude buddha nature everywhere, like i'm already a buddha dude, how cool is that! like nothing totally matters yo, nirvana and samsara is the same dude

In fact, I think that's the main reason why most of those teachings used to be kept secret: in the unprepared hands and minds of mundanes they become a road to spiritual degeneracy.

>>120693

Just because some old degenerate fucks wrote this down ages ago doesn't mean its true, especially now. If they would see the world we live in now they would probably say that great horror awaits a man who still brings children into this place. Unless they are shills and minions of the demiurge to begin with, then they obviously would push you into making new slaves for the matrix regardless.

Never trust old teachings too much. They come from another time with another mindset and are not rarely full of shit.

>>120974

do not trust anyone

Who fears death and misery obviously is not spiritually perfected. A true hermeticist would prepare himself to be able to raise children without fear, ignorance, and mediocrity.

>>121015

A even truer hermeticist simply wouldn't give a fuck about either way and just go with what is.

It is important to procreate for the simple reason that white personalities are higher in quality than black ones. Much like how an animals personality is considered higher in quality to a trees. The cosmic will is continuously creating and forming higher forms of personality that are increasingly capable of understanding the situation they are in. To destroy the relative complexity of white thought would result in the planet earth reverting to a baser form and would merely slow down the awakening of the upper echelons of the human race, which are currently mired in materialism and desire by the machinations of the jews.

>>121034

Do you think these things have a way of balancing themselves out naturally? I've heard that during the post-war baby boom, an improportionate amount of boys were born, seemingly to make up for the loss of men in the war.

>>121046

Everything follows cause and effect. Everything follows the principles. If it does fix itself it'll have to have SOME sort of cause. But what with the collective opinion of the remaining world being "fuck whitey" and with the only potential magic users orchestrating the whole thing then I reckon we'd be fucked.

>>121139

Fancy talk but makes no sense at all when you think about it from a wizards perspective. Please explain clearly what you mean by "Darkness" and "Good" and how it affects someone dependend on what he does.

Because without further explanation is sounds like another lame attempt at "do as I say and go to heaven, or disobey and go to hell" of which we had so many recently.

>>121139

So are you just defining good as that which strives towards a higher order then? Because I can be very evil and still strive for a higher order.