/fringe/ - Fringe

>>98275

But Gnosticism is a branch of Christianity so how can it be inherently opposed to it?

>>98274

This is a good example of the summary or the general concisement of Gnostic belief, that in someway the God of the Old Testament is a creator and extension of God, but not God in It's Absolute form, which is one of Love and Mercy; not death, vengeance and brutality.

One thing however which always seems to be circumvented for talk on existential and relative beliefs of varying Gnostic sects is that of Gnosis itself. Gnostics believed a variety of things and changed their beliefs for they were not static. They did not have a religious leader nor any priests to tell them how they should live their lives indefinitley. Gnosticism, at its very core, is about the self-realisation and spiritual process of God and yourself, to them it lies at the very foundation of ALL religious experience. Summarising, so casually, Gnosticism to be simply a belief in demiurge and discardment of conventional Abrahamic faith is in some ways demeaning, and although accurate in a very relative way, also extremely far from the mark of what lies at the center. Gnosticism is inseperable from Gnosis, study Gnosis and you shall know Gnosticism. Truly one can never have full satisfaction from others words, as to the Gnostic only that which is beyond words and human boundaries is an adeqaute communication of what Gnosticism really is. The Nag Hammadi scriptures are incredibly beautiful by the way; I am sure the Divine Spark could be ignited to almost all within one of those many pages.

>>98276

This is glaringly innacurate and short-sighted for so many obvious reasons. Christians invented ritual magic, the pentagram, and angels? You say Gnosticism was a branch from the "original" Christianity, when the literarture and historical evidence actually points to it being the eldest of all the Christian perspectives. In its direct sense it is entwined in mysticism, and it certainly was not simply pulled out of midair, it was the encapsulation of a multitude of traditions that came before it.

>>98373

The Gospel of Thomas is a really good one because it is what the 4 canonical Gospels are condensed into purely proverbial works with no actions behind them. There is also a really great reenactment or filmed adaptation which I think did a really good job of placing everything together you can watch it here; https://www.youtube.com/ watch?v=YqQUHXfqR6I . "Whoever finds the INTERPRETATION will not taste death." This leads up to what I am going to say to >>98374

In my view, and this resonates with the hermetic principles of correspondence and polarity, is that within the Gospels there are relative and absolute truths. The result that we end up with is that the Bible means, inherently, very different things to each individual whilst still containing a core or foundation on which each existential truth is built upon. This is the seed, you are the would be plant, and your actions are the fruit which it bears. When you think of this on a deeper level you realise that the Gospels are an infinite amount of perspectives as long as there are individuals to extract what they will from it. It never dies. It is continually moving and eternal, the very words, the logos, ever-changing, ever-permeating; not a dead stone which stays static. History has proven this, or even this board, almost everyone here will have a different view on what the Bible is or what is at its core, even though we have all read the same words. The existential religions/philosophies last long and extend into new people all the time throughout millenia, ones that the basis is on the individual and self-realization, because they do not block and deny. Of course certain sects have tried to; Catholicism is an easy example, an that is precisely why it is so hard for them to gain more followers. Something like Gnosticism however sits in a cave for 2000 years and its teachings still spark that inquistive SEEKING which is at the heart of all living things. Others are like brick walls and dead ends. Buddhism, Hinduism, Mysticism, these things last and captivate because they ask you; not tell you. They still go strong today without much enforcement, whilst many other dominant religions of today only last because they are forced upon others or conditioned in a traditional like manner. So many religions have died, completely impenetrable and beyond our boundaries of context, to ever truly practice or understand. Thats because they held to firmly on to their relative truths, unable to ground it on a basis of absolute which then enables outsiders to form their own relatives respective to themselves and era. Of course, not all religions were meant to be spread and of course that is not the only reason. Part of the consistent rhetorical problem we have is that of over-generalising when nothing is ever that simple. Part of the beauty in things I suppose.

>>98411

Manly P Hall is a good writer in his own right though his wider books such as STAA can be a little vague and mostly serve as just an introduction and reference to various beginnings of esotericism. If you want to get into the meat of his research, philosophy and practices then you should definitley check out his lectures which are still widely available for download and on youtube. There are 100s of them and some of them are really illuminating whilst not always being about the occult and sometimes just going into esoteric anthropology.

What you want to do is instead of trying to find a hard copy of the Gospel of Thomas (which will be tiny) is buy the complete Nag Hammadi scriptures in one volume. You can get them very cheap on amazon in some great editions which are annotated to provide full context and also contain introductory essays by the scholars and translators, maybe you don't plan to read them now, though they definitley provide a lot of context over that which you would have of just picking up the Gospel of Thomas and never heard of it - if you did that it would confuse the shit out of you. A very concise, but very well written and argumented, is Elain Pagels "The Gnostic Gospels." This book will go through the history of the early christian era, examining the arguments between the Orthodox and Gnostic sects, their political power and outcomes, and go into depth in some areas of the Nag Hammadi itself in a very easy to grasp and read format from any level of understanding on the subject. It is not all comprehensive but it is an excellent place to begin and get a good insight.

The final reccomendation that I have is a 4 part documentary sereis released in the UK in the 90's on TV called "Gnostics". You can find them all on youtube also and they are very well made, sometimes reenacting historical events and speeches, interviewing the leading scholars and historians on the subject but giving you a really great narrative and story with in each episode. It extends from stuff like the Cathars, to the Medicis, to Jung, you can watch them all here:

Gnostics 1/4 - Knowledge of the Heart - https://youtu.be/t6RLWbOSvUw

Gnostics 2/4 - Cathars, the True Christians - https://youtu.be/q8iuWixkFXw

Gnostics 3/4 - The Divinity of Man - https://youtu.be/0lGH785eI-E

Gnostics 4/4 - Crack in the Universe - https://youtu.be/JxxxmXkJums

After taking your time going through some of this work and a bit of contemplation I am sure all of your basic questions on Gnosticism will be answered, although be prepared to have many many more questions once you have them, the rabbit hole is particularly deep.