/fringe/ - Fringe

If this retarded system works for you, it's because certain variables were in favour of you achieving subconscious success during the working, and not because of complete understanding. Any true aspirant of occult powers must obtain a complete understanding of the work of magick and not just perform improperly explained over mystified rituals that may or may not work. Occultism should be precise and scientific like based Atkinson describes in Genuine Mediumship or The Invisible Powers http://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/25337

>>49322

Actually it work because "Different Strokes for Different Folks" no need to over complicate shit and shit on anything not made by Atkinson.

If you do everything you get a desired result. What is happening behind the

scenes is open for debate. No one can prove if spirits are part of my

subconscious or separate entities all their own.

Visualisation is how spirits communicate - the words of the spells are there

ONLY to focus your mind on your intent (if you are not well trained enough to do

this without a statement of intent) and to rouse emotions. The 'will' or 'desire'

that comes with focused intent, combined with the emotions need to be put intoa "liquid" state so that it can be transfered to the spirit. Unless this is done, how will the spirit know what you are trying to achieve?

>>49326

No sorry but your system is simply inferior. A real system gets to the heart of the matter and is very clear, no ambiguity. When something goes wrong, you know exactly why, and you know what requirements need to be met to do something. Your system is incomplete, arbitrary, and requires outside knowledge to make effective use of it. You say "if you do everything you get a desired result" well the rituals in your system are just random ass rituals that may or may not work and not everything is explained. A true occultist knows how to make his own rituals and understands the principles by which the rituals he constructs works. It's neophyte faggots who are taken in by the allure of overly mystical random rituals. When someone is totally new to the occult they think of dudes wearing robes performing ritual actions but fail to understand principle.

>What is happening behind the scenes is open for debate. No one can prove if spirits are part of my subconscious or separate entities all their own.

Statements like this just prove what an underdeveloped neophyte you are. If you think I am suggesting mundane psychological explanations which are equally invalid at explaining the workings, you are wrong. Magick works by certain laws which are as quantifiable and easily understood as physical equations.

>the rest of the shit you said

That's just a half-assed understanding of how thoughtforming works. You need to read more in-depth into this matter of thoughtforms and their creation and empowerment and skip past the jewish nonsense.

>>49330

>snoppy shit you just said

NAP was made for housewives who wanted direct magick and Geoff didn't want to get into detail, if you actually stud it you would understand that how deep it's but because people like you are actually practicing "New Age" and wanting to sound "MUH MAGICAL AUTHORITY" be my guest and shit on everything and praise only Atkinson/Bardon.Whatever people do it and they got results if you don't want to work with entities and only want to act demiugric go ahead and create your "legion" of spirits.

I bet you want to shun the system because people are actually having better results and developing faster than you do

also

(Judge on NAP just by reading the summary and doesn't know shit about Magic Mentor)

>>16000

>>49332

Stay butthurt and mundane Geoff shill. Atkinson is far superior.

>I bet you want to shun the system because people are actually having better results and developing faster than you do

Except they aren't at all and I'm already leagues ahead of your pathetic attainments.

>>49335

>Atkinson is far superior.

>Implying he's

> leagues ahead of your pathetic attainments.

>implying

Trying to use heremtic and atkinson material by you is like giving a job of a company CEO to a hobo, get your shit together than talk.When you finish repair your four lower circuits/spehira/chakra come talk here.

>Doesn't know shit about K&C

'Most people who rave on and on about how "powerful" they are, are usually completely ineffectual anyway. The truly dangerous are those that don't have to announce it loudly.'

Phil Hine

>>49335

>>49337

tfw smiley is atkinson shill and omran is geoff shill and RAW/Leary shill

errbody shill here :~)

Take what works and discard what doesn't, friends.

>>49337

>'Most people who rave on and on about how "powerful" they are, are usually completely ineffectual anyway. The truly dangerous are those that don't have to announce it loudly.'

>Phil Hine

Yeah and I've met actual powerful people and they demonstrated it by a show of power. They didn't talk about it, they just did things, and there was no debate to be had for their power was not in question at all thereafter.

I'm not afraid of you in the least.

>>49339

>Take what works and discard what doesn't, friends.

…but his garbage is an approximation of the truth and Atkinson is direct and dry and straightforward. It might not be as exciting to read but you will ACTUALLY UNDERSTAND when you've completed the readings why things work. If you follow this NAP crap you will be left wondering why something worked or didn't work after the fact. There is no ambiguity with Atkinson.

Some of the buddhist sects I would recommend also because they just give you straight forward meditations with a very specific and precise explanation of what is required and what will result from the practice thereof. Not "chant a bunch of nonsense, evoke some entities by these silly names, wave your arms around, see where it gets you". However most Buddhist stuff is made less under-stable by the use of terminology from another language. Atkinson is better for English speakers.

>>49339

>Take what works and discard what doesn't, friends

This

>I'm not afraid of you in the least.

okay whatever who said that you should be.

>>49341

"WA WA WHY PEOPLE ARE USING THINGS OTHER THAN ATKINSON THIS IS ATKINSON BOARD EVERYONE READ ATKINSON"

Well this book was direct at people who are in shit position and wanted to improve, they weren't aiming to make it all "Scientific".Sure when you settle in your life and live a good, stable life then you can start doing scientific experiments rather than begin in a position where you sincerely need help and don't have shiton of time to read huge books.

>>49342

kek, you've threatened me, then you pretend like you don't

You can't deliver on your intentions, you don't have enough Desire Power TM (loosh) behind them to succeed, nor the knowledge necessary for the construction and management of potent thoughtforms, or (and particularly important for the shit you're into) the contact of specific spirits (indeed your whole system is a contrived way to create a bunch of lame thoughtforms and if you harbor ideas of "it could just be my subconscious" you've already undermined yourself.) which if you knew how to actually do that you'd find out they probably don't want you bothering them and they'd also be able to tell you far more and you'd find they've actually changed much since whatever ignorant authors wrote about them.

>Well this book was direct at people who are in shit position and wanted to improve, they weren't aiming to make it all "Scientific".Sure when you settle in your life and live a good, stable life then you can start doing scientific experiments rather than begin in a position where you sincerely need help and don't have shiton of time to read huge books.

These garbage rituals are the exact same kind of shit that some earnest seekers fall upon and then fail with and become fedoras.

Any occult book worth its salt would at least tell people how rituals are constructed and how rituals work, rather than trying to give specifics.

Even Franz Bardon is better than what you're peddling buddy.

I'm so happy people are starting to see NAP for the obvious bullshit that it is. I tried it for a while and wound up finding broken glass in my food and almost got hit by a truck. These are not 'helper spirits' by any measure of anybody's stick. These spirits are not your friends.

>>49344

NAP doesn't even get you into contact with spirits by the standard definition of that word defined in the glossary for /fringe/. It's just a way to trick you into making some thoughforms OR in some cases attracting the attention of elemental beings who will take over whatever shells you've created for them to begin to mess around with you. To actually contact the spirit of someone is a very different matter. It is like how there's all these issues with necromancy where necromancers manage to evoke the caste off astral body of someone that is dead or bring about various other astral phenomena but fail to reach the genuine actual spirit of the person that has passed on.

NAP is an unreliable pop magick system and there are no short-cuts in the occult, this bears repeating ad infinum, anyone who gets into magick thinking it's the easier way to do things is wrong. It's like with psychokinesis, it's easier to just grab the pen and move it across your desk with your hand, then to do it with your mind. The occult isn't for people that want an easy shortcut through life, it's for people with immense patience who are very thorough and careful about what they do, if they honestly want to achieve anything significant. Moving the pen by the mind isn't about moving the pen, it's about the insight in the nature of reality. Yet what if someone moves the pen once but then tries what they think they did again and fails to do it twice? That's the problem with NAP, if they achieve success or not, these people following this particular system don't really know how. NAP isn't about principles, it's a collection of stupid rituals, chants, etc. aka all flare and no substance. The practitioner has to accidentally bring substance into the system.

"According to your faith be it unto you." Magic is the impregnation of the subconscious with the intent of the conscious. What you tell your subconscious matters. If you believe NAP is crap, then guess what? It's not ritual that's doing the magic: it's you. The ritual is just a tool.

I've heard very advanced magicians say that they've had great success with NAP. It's what you make of it.

>>49356

Thinker Think Prover prove, I really feel bad that I gave NAP to Smiley it seem that he need just to "contain" himself with Atkinson's books.Good Thing he didn't try IGM

>>49354

>being such a neophyte faggot you disparage emotion; the source of all power, the fuel behind all manifestation, the energy of thoughtforms, the most precious resource of the universe

>>49356

You don't get it you worthless faggot. No shit any advanced magician can make NAP work for them. If you already are a trained occultist who has mastered the occult principles you can pick any random pantheon, chants, and other "dressings" you want and make it work for you.

Any decent occult text will say essentially what you just said but without the shrink terms and dressings. Atkinson avoids dressings and teaches you the core principles. NAP IS CRAP because it's a bunch of shitty rituals that depends upon external variables for success. The other systems aren't shit because instead of saying "chant blah blah and invoke blah blah" they give you the actual formulas such as Intent, Desire, Expectation, Concentration, etc. and teach you how to make a ritual out of anything and then you will know what you're actually doing, what to expect, and why things happen the way they do. It becomes an exact science, you get back what you put out, you leverage your power, etc.

Grimoars might looks fancy with their spells, rituals, drawings, and personalized shit but they're never meant to be used outside of select highly insular cults or even on a purely individual basis. The neophyte looking at grimoars and doing what it says in them will not achieve success or if he does he certainly won't achieve mastery, he won't know why he achieved success.

You can't go wrong with Atkinson, he gives you the "thing in a nutshell". Only unimaginative people find Atkinson inadequate as they have to go read some other texts to borrow ideas from to create their thoughtforms or they have to wait for someone like me to create a personalized ritual for them as for them it's not enough to know the principle, they fail to use the principle constructively, for lack of imagination. THEN AGAIN if they read volume II of Personal Power, the part called "Creative Power", and weren't idiots they should have begun at that point to constructively use their imagination. Besides art, videogames, mythology, archetypes, etc. can all drawn upon for ideas to construct your thoughtforms. Lets not also forget that the imaginatively deficient neophyte STILL needs to read Atkinson first before he starts fucking around with something like NAP since he's so much of a Brainless Sissy Retard he can';t create from scratch he needs to borrow older ideas and copy them.

It's not "what you make of it" NAP is objectively inferior as is any other occult texts like it. The fact you have to explain why NAP fails for some people shows it's a shitty system.

Just look at this garbage: http://napsummary.blogspot.ca/

You don't need ANY of it. It also has little relevance to anyone who hasn't read the semitic texts (Bible, etc.) which the various entities referenced here come from and which the NAP author no doubt assumes his readers already know. It's rubbish!! If you knew the principles of evocation, ritual, invocation, suggestion, thoughtforming, astral senses, and other occult basics and you really wanted to evoke (or more probably recreate as new thoughtforms since that's a hell of a lot easier and more practical) these entities all you'd need to do next would be to read the Bible itself and made some of those jew texts that might mention the relevant entities then you could do so and skip this watered down NAP crap.

I for one don't want a series of thoughtforms named after jewish entities. I bet you neophytes don't even know how to do the Orthodox prayer of the heart or how to successfully move beyond the abstraction of labels and personality while still effectively operating. I prefer to either call upon or create my entities without use of name or even any words at all, using direct arcane power to attract an astral entity fitting the requirements of my intent and desire, and if they wish to reveal their name to me they can do so and it happens to be that of a famous entity I am app to dismiss them or have lowered trust in them; I certainly will challenge them as to their authenticity.

I've done the Middle Pillar ritual before btw long ago.

>>49374

Yeah alright, good job on begin right. *thumb up*

Of course you're the greatest most powerful magician in here.

>>49378

The map is not the territory.

>>49378

Do you have any suggestions/tips/advice that would help a neophyte such as myself?

>>49397

First tell me briefly how developed your astral senses are, which books you've already read, what timescales you're looking at (in it for the long-term or what?), how much time you have (relationships, jobs, etc. is any of this eating up your study and practice time), how much risk you're willing to tolerate, whether your present modality is full of doubts and holes or nuisance limitations, whether or not you have critical experience in crossing informational and physical boundaries, and I will give my feedback.

The best mode of development is a steady practice of the foundations of magick, a clear understanding of the metaphysics of magick, a gradual building up of the mind and the body, an expansion of knowledge into the nuances of various subfields of magick in order to avoid errors and confusion, a peppering of more advanced experimental magickal operations to serve as inspiration (don't let it get out of hand), followed eventually by a much deeper intensification of the work including a massive intensification and fine-tuning of the astral senses and a set of thoughtforms for various purposes.

Unfoldment in this way is steady, gradual… but not too slow. You can expect to be at a very high level of development and operational efficiency in just 5 years as long as you can avoid the scourge of endless distractions in their various forms. You should also integrate magickal practice into everything you do from breathing to sleeping to eating to counting to talking and creating.

>>49405

I'm not that anon from >>49397 but can I ask the same thing?

Reading this thread I gained tons of respect for you. Basically you put in words things that I've been only thinking about NAP and other similar shits, but couldn't articulate them properly (which is a common case with me - I feel and perceive much but can't really put it into words).

But whatever, about my request:

I started with Atkinson, but never finished all the books from sticky, I dislike the writing style of Atkinson's. Don't get me wrong, I gained a shitload of knowledge from him, but it's not my thing. His metaphores, his "science will soon proove this" attitude… Well, I suppose at some point or another I will go back and finish his books.

I'm much into Tantra (Left Hand Tantra especially), I read classics like Arthur Avalon, and a bunch of original tantric texts (I mention this only because most people assume Tantra = New Age "divine" sexuality rubbish, I don't), and it gives me good results. I tried many systems, searched far and wide, but I haven't yet found anything that would click with me. I stopped searching eventually, now I try not to follow any system, but get to the roots of things (as you mentioned in one post). I read or started reading various occult texts in my search but listing them would be pointless.

My plans are developing energy body (Robert's Bruce methods) and learning how to astral project. I have a lot of time, it isn't limiting me. I'm willing to tolerate a lot of risk. I don't want to be an armchair occultist, I want to have an actual experience, I want to do things and have things happen to me. I have some mundane stuff dragging me down, but I can take care of it. I don't have any doubts.

I want to add that I've already had success with my practise. I fixed my life in many ways via occult.

A few benefits to nap: the self-hypnosis relaxation part before the middle pillar hugely improves the middle pillar. Also having a period of relaxation allows for space for "contact".

>>49419

Tantra without tears by Hyatt, practical with some theory.

>>49423

Thanks, I will look into it, but I already have a program of tantric practice.

>>49425

you know the usual danger of the tantra right?

>>49426

The usual danger? I know about some dangers, but they are a bit unusual. Each path has it's dangers.

I took a look at "Tantra without tears" and from what I've gathered this book is a bit like NAP: they give you how to do something, but they don't tell you why this something occurs. To explain Tantra you have to know a shitload of Hindu terms, and you have to have a "Hindu mindset" so to speak, hence so much misconceptions in Western civilisation about Eastern Esotericism. That's why I don't like oversimplified "tantra for Westerners" (and the author confesses to such attitude right off the bat). I will read this book, maybe my first impression is wrong, and if it's right I will cross-reference my current knowledge.

also

>Crowley reference

Thank you regardless.

I recommened it in another thread, but it's one of best books on the subject I've read - Kali Kaula. Entry level into tantra with some practical pointers: meditations, mantras, mudras, chakras, Kundalini etc. and a shitload of useful theory.

>>49427

Addendum: That book is shit-tier. The author takes one page to describe something as complicated as for example "Tantric view of the Universe" (not to mention that there is no one, single, tantric point of view).

>mundane titles like "can I get addicted to tantra"

>stating that gods do not have any real meaning to practitioner

It's a basic overview of some tantric ideas with possible disinfo for people who never ever had contact with tantra. Each idea is oversimplified to extremum and his writings carry almost none real information. Dr. Hyatt scratched the surface of the world of tantra, not grasping the gyst of the matter.

>>49427

well it's not that much i actually thought you wanted to get to know tantra(sorry I didn't understand you).Secret of Western Tantra have the execrise and mainly focus on clearing the blockage.

he first 2 exercises in EM are the first 2 warmups in SOWT, then there are 2 more warmups. Exercise 3 in EM is not in SOWT. Then the 4 "sections" in the sex magick part of EM are the same, almost word for word, in SOWT. The only difference is that he suggests doing a warmup then doing a section, instead of keeping them seperate.

Afterwards SOWT goes into tantric intercourse, more indepth information about the chakras, shows how you can use tarot in tantra(essentially invoking cards during orgasm), astrology, lesser banishing ritual of the pentagram, the middle pillar ritual(though I wasn't aware you should be having sex while you perform it), and a bunch of extra information in the appendix.

>>49434

>the middle pillar ritual(though I wasn't aware you should be having sex while you perform it),

oooh baby yehhhh baby YEEEEEEEEEH HOOOOOOOOOOOOVAAAAAAAAAAAAAA ELLLLOOOHEEEEEEEM

>>49437

You sir deserve a medal, you're the first one to make me chuckle in a week in /fringe/.

>>49434

>intercourse

>sex

>orgasm

>sex magick

You do realise that most tantric cults recommend celibacy? That most intercourses in orginal tantras were metaphores (or were supposed to take place in your mind's eye and not in this plane)? Actually I'm a bit triggered right now. Tantra isn't about sex. It's a complex system of Magic, not some excuse for fucking under the cover of "tantric sex" or "sex magick". Read a book which isn't shit for a change.

Tantra =/= sex magick

New Age Rubbish Tantra = some sexual education and visualizing some colors emerging from penis or whatever

You recommened me a book, but you seem to not have a clue about what consitutes real tantra.

>>49439

Tantra is about indulging into desires with sensitive awareness and mastering the polarity by love and not by control?

>>49441

No.

Also, there have been various schools and various tantriks throughout the history.

Take cakras - they are a tantric concept, or Kundalini. Tantra has an enormous system of invocations amd evocations. More meditations than everyone would ever need. Energy work, visualisations etc. It's like any other magical system just older and more refined and with an enormous canon of literature.

What are you talking about is just a small facet of the world of tantra, because yes, I've met this concept in works of some gurus - that you shouldn't fight with something, just accept and, in time, transcend. And it's wise. But it is not a matter of indulging in pleasures and desires in a hope that it would make you a better person.

In a broader meaning - yes. Tantra escapes all dualities, so if that's what you meant you are right.

Take tantric sex - you and your partner both have to have a special training, you have to be prepared in various ways, not just go to bed, do quick meditation and hope for the best. Also, what pleasure are we talking about, as most tantras condemn male orgasm?

>>49442

Not to mention that it's different thing when you talk to an adherent of Saivism, Saktism, Vaisnavism or Smartism or a shitload of other branches.

Tantra is too complex for me to put it into posts, it can't be after all put into a book too. It's certainly too complex to be summarised in

>indulging into desires with sensitive awareness and mastering the polarity by love and not by control

Perhaps my knowledge isn't that vast. I'm not roleplaying as some guru or a master of "true tantra". After all I'm not a Hindu and I'm not a tantrik, I'm just a neophyte who read some books and done some meditations, but stil, my knowledge is far greater than yours.

>>49443

>>49442

First I want to apologize for what I have said as I have taken time to contemplate into what you mean.Yes Tantra is way too broad to be fit into one book and yes my book talk about sex magick, and I hope that you don't take it as really "tantra" there.I wasn't focusing on traditionally "tantra" there(heck traditionally tantra is far older than most system that today exist) I wanted to give a book that actually deal with removing the blockage of one's conditioning and achiving supreme godhood.Since you wanted traditional Tantra go ahead to your book and again I am sorry if that triggered you since I had not intention to do that and of course I have less knowledge than yours.

>>49445

No worries. If I would loose my loosh over some Internet discussion I wouldn't be much of a occultist, eh?

It just saddens me greatly that people assume that tantra is just sex veiled in some exotic terms. It is SO MUCH MORE (and other) than that. If you get it, then peace.

I didn't intend to sound mean either, you have your way and I have mine.

Godspeed.

Also

>achieving supreme godhood

That's what LH Tantra is all about, as Evola stated:

"There is a significant difference between the two Tantric paths, that of the right hand and that of the left hand (which both are under Shiva's aegis). In the former, the adept always experiences 'someone above him', even at the highest level of realization. In the latter, 'he becomes the ultimate Sovereign' (chakravartin = worldruler)."

>>49446

Doesn't all valid path lead to the absolute?

>It just saddens me greatly that people assume that tantra is just sex veiled in some exotic terms. It is SO MUCH MORE (and other) than that. If you get it, then peace.

yeah man I get it but the thing with tantra is just so complex and complicated and most of the time I got tired of making sense of all these rituals(yes I know simplex behavior) and go to pragmatic magic.I know that my attitude toward magic doesn't seem like "understand the rules and the structure" as I like to understand the basic laws and then keep going,modifying little by little.

>>49425

>listening to Omran

>>49419

Robert Bruce I have like no respect for. All he has done of any worth is popularize some useful generic terms for referencing entities in the astral such as "neg" or simply "entity". You won't lrn2astral with Robert Bruce.

The physical plane is an astral plane.

There are 7x7x7x7x7x7x7 planes total.

You just need to will your consciousness to tune into the right planes.

Whenever you think thoughts you're operating upon the mental plane.

You can interact with the astral without following projecting; see psychomancy and crystal gazing. You can use black mirrors, thoughtforms, black cloth strips, crystal balls, etc. anything to help you lose focus on the physical so you can peer into the mental planes.

Getting into the astral is easy but energy intensive. It requires a ton of emotion and raw energy.

Please learn what the astral is before you try to navigate it, read "The Astral World" by Swami Panchadasi (William Walker Atkinson) and also Life Beyond Death by Yogi Ramacharaka (also William Walker Atkinson).

The first book is the shorter of the two and you don't really need to read both.

The main points are planes overlap, they're not other places, and you need to lrn2navigate them properly.

The other thing I'm going to tell you is you need to unfold all your astral senses and all the senses are advanced phases of one basic sense; feeling.

For today or you can start tomorrow or you can do it for just one hour if you feel short on time I want you to become hyper aware of everything you touch, every pressure you feel, the sensation of air pressing down on your body, the sensation of objects pressing against your body, the feeling of blood inside of your body, food inside your stomach, things taking up space, touching things, etc.

After you're done that start using the imagination to create forms and give them these qualities of space, pressure, texture, etc. and touch them with your imagined hands (astral hands). If you have to practice touching and feeling everything in your room then reproducing it in the imagination.

This will prepare the way.

There will be similar practices for smelling, tasting, hearing, and sight… and there are 2 more senses as well but you need not worry about them for now as they're closed to you until much later.

Astral projection is simply a matter of powering up your aura intensely and parting a bit of it into what is a thoughtform which drifts away from the aura powered by the desire channeled into it. Except you transfer your awareness into this thought-form at the same time.

Read this also: http://www.gutenberg.org/files/25337/25337-h/25337-h.htm

This text is very necessary to achieving Adepthood one day as after you've developed all the basics and feel well prepared you're going to want to develop mediumship to learn and connect to far more.

Also read Dolores Ashcroft-Nowicki's Magical Use of Thoughtforms but in the interest of avoiding delusion don't use her pantheons just read the book through without doing the practices, just do it to get an idea of things, then start crafting your own thoughtforms.

>>49427

Dude why are you letting Omran waste your time with this shit?

>inb4 I have to write my own version of Initiation Into Hermetics to help BSR neophytes rapid unfold without delusions.

>>49446

>>49447

>muh unity/identification with absolute

>actually wanting / striving for this consciously or thinking you even know what it is to want this

I don't even want to begin to touch on how stupid this idea is but I'm going to have to.

It pisses me off to see any human who basically got loosh-overloaded one day think they've even touched the skirt of the absolute.

It's supposed to take eons of time over many incarnations for the magus to merge with the All and long before then you would have ceased to be human in any manner.

If you can't even into psychokinesis I don't want to hear your druggy babble about being One with All.

…and if you can into psychokinesis, and very well at that, I still don't want to hear it and must wonder why you don't know better.

>This Principle embodies the truth that "All is Mind." It explains that THE ALL (which is the Substantial Reality underlying all the outward manifestations and appearances which we know under the terms of "The Material Universe"; the "Phenomena of Life"; "Matter"; "Energy"; and, in short, all that is apparent to our material senses) is SPIRIT, which in itself is UNKNOWABLE and UNDEFINABLE, but which may be considered and thought of as AN UNIVERSAL, INFINITE, LIVING MIND.

>yfw the All can never even know itself due to its infinite nature constantly unfolding

>>49478

Are you not already one with the "All"? Is the "All" not immanent in all things?

You are already fully integrated with the "All", no effort needs to be extended, your attempts at knowing the "All" are by your own words futile:

>yfw the All can never even know itself due to its infinite nature constantly unfolding

Stripping everything else away, you will find at your core a reflection or fragment of the Universal Will (or "All"), from which all desire originates.

Then the gulf between your experience of reality and (the unknowable) reality as it is is equivalent to or originates from the inability of the All to know itself.

1. Can someone tell me what is so bad about Bardon's system and recommend something better and why?

>>49480

Yes indeed.

>>49484

It's not bad at all, just start doing the practices and reading Atkinson alongside of it, as Atkinson fills all the gaps in IIH.

>>49485

I feel I should get a full grasp on theory before any practical work, primarily because as of right now it seems that the cosmos only responds to what you or your consciousness fully comprehends and knows to be true. So I want to fully believe that when I project intent into the air around me, that it's really happening. My mind leans more towards believing it's happening, but I am still doubtful. So I have been reading, meditating, contemplating everything from occult concepts to quantum physics, etc. But at the same time, I don't want to get too carried away to the point of solipsism or something. I want to create positive change in this very real world by serving truth.

>>49486

IIH is basic as fuck just start doing it there's nothing wrong with starting now. It's stuff like tulpas that need more planning and preparation.

>>49439

Um, actually it's about uniting with your exact compliment partner, the exact same mathematical equation you represent only on a gender-opposite spectrum… then fusing both sexual fluids including menstrual blood and both consuming it along with generating circuit of energy and eventually re-forming back into the pure androgynous balanced being.

And tantra means a doctrine or a system, it is called such simply as THE system as it has no THE as we do it now in our latin/westernized language…

The ultimate everything really is creating progeny with the highest logistics for cementing another singularity in the existence's continuum of the self-betterment and refining process of the all.

And i do agree with you a lot of fools are using this as an excuse to just fuck anything for magick but this is generally 90% influenced by crowley's work and not pashcal beverly randolph's or sunyata saraswati.

I have a sort of challenge for you.

watch this whole series all 4 parts https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nLEVVZbtITs

>>49483

This

>>49475

Thank you. I've already read the Astral World, Life Beyond Death, Magical Use of Thoughtforms.

I'll listen to your suggestions, do the exercise, ditch Robert Bruce, read other books you mentioned and see where it gets me.

>>49478

I'm not trying to unite with Absolute.

>>49511

Actually "tantra" means "text", and I already explained in >>49442 how it is bigger than what you are thinking it is. How chakras, mantras, mudras, yantras, invocations, meditations are fitting into your view of tantra? If it's only

>using both sexual fluids including menstrual blood and both consuming it along with generating circuit of energy and eventually re-forming back into the pure androgynous balanced being

then they are not valid part of tantra I presume?

Also, act of consuming sexual secretions can be metaphorical in some tantras.

>>49521

If you want to use the technique I use all the time for mediumship, astral projection, and basically just trying to attract random astral shit then well, I keep changing it constantly, but last few days it's just been creating astral marbles and then willing them to be tossed around in pipes and stuff and watching them as the spin and roll about and attract more random astral shit to them which then comes into view and gets revealed without you thinking about it. You don't know what you'll get but you can try charging things with intense desires if you want to go for something specific but that's not what I do this. I do this to get random shit with no effort which then energizes me just by not having to project any but a minimum of force to attract it. If you construct a lot of astral stuff from scratch it's exhausting.

Seriously in a few hours I'll be doing something like this, might not be marbles because I don't care what the form is exactly, and ummm if you do this and random other stuff appears don't worry about it just keep it in focus as you go deeper. Were you trying to create a marble and you ended up with a tree? Spin the tree around and pull astral matter to it. After a few minutes or a few seconds, depending on your loosh reserves, you should accumulate sufficient force of concentration and will that you will be in the astral proper and can proceed with exploration or stabilization or other tasks.

The key here is to project only what is necessary while receiving without planning the rest as much as possible.

If you just create a sphere and suddenly it has a certain texture and look to it that will do.

The spinning around of things helps a lot as does trying to shift your angle of view and zooming in and out.

You can just project a sphere as your focus then while focusing on the sphere intend a room comes into view around you and eventually you might end up in a room and then you can create portals n' shit through various techniques. Anything that is out of view if you just walk up to it more shit will be generated automatically so that's a way to get yourself into the astral. Make a basic room with a door and all you've got to do is focus on the door and open it up and there will be shit behind it, who knows what exactly, but that can be a way to get you out there.

AP is so much harder and exhausting though then most of the techniques described in Psychomancy. You could just construct any one of the various mediums described in http://www.yogebooks.com/english/atkinson/1907psychomancy.pdf or http://montalk.net/notes/psychomantium and use that as a way to interact with the astral easier with less cost of astral energy. I recommend getting some black pillow cases.

>tfw eating the DRV of fat that someone is supposed to eat in like 5-10 days every day and it's not enough

>tfw can eat say 400% the DRV of fat in one sitting and burn through it using AP in just 1-2 hours and can actually feel force running through my brain and nerves and heat generation and so on

>tfw fat is most concentrated form of calories you can get

>tfw tibetan monks drink tea with butter and salt, I do the same thing except tea with coconut oil and no salt

Not sure if I should start consuming more salt, I think I'm good there…

The astral is wonderful at taking patterns, both very ill-defined generic ones and precise ones, and weaving them into constructs btw.

>>49522

>>49524

>>49525

Thank you, you really helped me out. I've heard about this techniques here on fringe before but never knew how useful they are. Time for me to study up and get this show on a road.

I heard that tibetan monks used salt only for taste.

Godspeed.

>>49527

We;ll I find salt, regardless of whether it's himalayan or celtic or plain or whatever, pretty fucking awful.

>>49378

>Orthodox prayer of the heart

You've piqued my curiosity. Could you please post it?

>>49602

No I can't post it because it's literally a prayer of the heart. However this video describes the technique and I can tell you that it is a direct, wordless petition from the heart to God wherein your desire is acknowledged and heard fully and manifested without you having to say in words.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E-p1DmddP_I

>>49322

Is there a way to practice those exercises without another person? I can't imagine anyone i know would be willing to do this

>>49511

why are you anti-white didi?

>>52284

Why are you anti everything that is not white anon?

>>52284

>Are you anti-white didi?

That's the correct format.

You don't ask a question with your own answer in it, that's showing a lower intent.

If something works, why does it matter whether or not you understand it, after all, can these matters truly be understood in a concrete sense, or can one really only devise helpful theories of operation?

>>52392

First hand knowledge is also important.

>>52397

Won't the search for "first hand knowledge" be essentially endless, with layer upon layer of more and more primordial understanding being unraveled to the point that the individual would be better off in the scheme of things to choose their favorite plateau of understanding?

>>52402

No idea.

I meant the first hand experience gained from NAP makes it worthwhile. Learning to relax with the relaxation script (developing how-to practical knowledge of relaxation on cue), overcoming the psychic censor with first hand experience of magic working, whether positively or negatively. Also building the body of light in the middle pillar and the stuff that comes from that.

>>49483

Would you kindly share a list of good books or articles one could read in order to better understand this world and the forces that are involved

>>52407

Drugs, that's whats involved.

It works, dissosiates you from your body and gives you acces to other spiritual planes, that's cool.

But you can tell that shaman anon isn't very far in his spiritual path looking at his posts, his jimmies are rustled and he is easily triggerable. He's like a statue with a base made out of sand, very pretty, very beautiful, too bad it's going to fall when the first winds shows up.

I would advocate against using mind altering substances whenever possible before you have a solid snd balanced state of mind, body and being and has to a respecful degree tranceded this material plane.

>How do I know if I'm there yet ?

It shows up in every aspect of your life, you are feeling more grounded, calmer, considering all being as being part of the One System, thus showing love to them, you are based as fuck and successful in your physical endeavours/goals, you are healthy and always energic,…

Have at least the base to the heart chakra open and some experience with life, meditation mental alchemy and the use of the mind to accomplish your desires, take your time and really work first on you and your physical world and state of mind before reaching out to something as shallow as mushrooms and lsd.

You can use drugs when you don't need drugs, otherwise, you are just an emotionally unstable retard looking for something to fill his empty life.

Kek this fucking stupid thread.

Don't argue with these NAP shills, do what you want.

>>52413

>thus showing love to them

yeah, thats bullshit. Fear based entities can feed fear into us, but we can choose to not accept it. Same goes for sending love to them, they dont have to accept it.

Also, you don't know me, so I'd refrain from judging. Youre barely giving any information yourself, so I doubt you've actually had much practice or results.

>>52407

I honestly don't read that much right now, I've been in a transition period, trying to find a new place to live in. Tonsils just got hella fucked up too, but Im gonna use the oppurtunity to take a payed vacation with all my PTO hours at my job that Ive been saving up. I'd suggest learning to clear your thoughts so you can bypass mind and flow spirit into body instead. Only for divining though, Im still figuring out how to use magick with it. Recently figured out how to use slight telekinesis too, but the results are very minimal as it takes a LOT of concentration.

If you want someone who understands this crap go look at didi's information.

Just let your syncs flow you towards the information you wanna read.

Also, drugs are generally safe if you space out your usage and use to expand your mind instead of just for shits n giggles. Personally, mushrooms and dxm work best for me. Lsd doesn't help for anything for some reason, dont know why. But mushrooms connect me with the real version of myself and not the false ego Ive created. I actually tripped 2 nights ago under what seemed to be a golden moon. I was riding my bike around town at night acting like the channeled version of my higher self I used to communicate with a couple years back. Then I realized the girl I just met and started dating could be my twin flame, which I analyzed and then found out was true. I spent the next few minutes crying honestly. She's such a beautiful woman and Im lucky to have found her. Never been so inspired in my life, and ever since I met her I've been divining more information out of my ass like chocolate in a snickers factory.

>>52579

best way to dispell evil entities is to bro-out with them / make them know whos the fucking alpha / have a humor and jokes.